Jacuma Beach Resort

[Dotty]

Just contact Sol Melia and chat with them.That should clear up your concerns,because on here at times you cannot see the wood for the trees and it is pretty annoying .

[robh]

Originally Posted by Billie Jean

Hello Rob,

Thanks for the offer, I may take it up. But first could you please elaborate on how you 'Checked them out'. In gereral I need to know (via formal documents, not phone conversations) the financial history, profitability, trading reputation, sources of finance of the company, its ultimate owners.

For all we know the top man owning the developer could be a criminal

As an agent that has "Checked them out" you should be able to openly provide this information.

Thanks,
Billie

Billie,

As far as evaluating developments goes, we wont sell anything until we visit the site and the area, have the legals (licenses, agreements, title, etc,) checked by an independent lawyer, looked at the history (financial and performance) of the developer and have looked at the rental and capital gain potential for the development.

Your lawyer should be doing the checks you are after for you as it is part of the due diligence process.

Regards,
Rob.

[RalphJ]

Originally Posted by Raimundo

ROBH, I never stated that all Brazilians were bad, in fact most are good simple folks. What I am saying is Brazil (in my opinion) has a high scam/theft rate among foreigners/gringos compared to all other countries in Latin America. That really is all I am saying. The thing is, a lot of you guys here are trying to sell something in Brazil, realestate, servcies, etc. So anything I say about Brazil that might be negative, you and others will naturally not like because I might be effecting your personal income. I've already written about the rogue land scam deal we were involved. Check the archives.

I've lived off and on in Brazil 1999. I am simply telling folks to be very careful.

FCZ- if I were you, I would be very careful with your comments. I have nothing against anyone.

Those of us that live here understand exactly what you mean Ray.

The following is an excellent article by a Brazilian Ph.D. that has written numerous articles on Brazilians and Brazilian culture titled, "In Brazil, Rule of Law is for the Birds".


Brazil is a nation suffering from a substantial lack of commitment to the rule of law. As a result, most of what happens in Brazil lies outside the statute books and law reports. In that country there is indeed a very sharp contrast between, on the one hand, statutes and the written texts of the constitution, and, on the other hand, the daily life as demonstrated in the dealings between individuals and public authorities.

In an important survey conducted by DaMatta in the mid 1980s, citizens in Brazil were asked how they classify a person who obeys the law. The common answer was that such a person must be an individual of "inferior" social status. But when asked about a wealthy person who wishes to obey the law, the common answer to this situation was that this person is simply a babaca (fool). DaMatta then concluded from this empirical research that, in Brazil, "compliance with law conveys the impression of anonymity and great inferiority".

In Brazil, social status is far more important than any protection of the law, because laws are generally perceived as not being necessarily applied to everyone. Unlike a typical North American citizen who would use the law to protect him-or-herself against any situation of social adversity, a citizen in Brazil would instead appeal to his or her social status.

Respecting the law in this country implies a condition of social inferiority and disadvantage that renders one subject to it. As the late historian José Honório Rodrigues observed: "In Brazil, personal liking is above the law". And so the familiar Brazilian maxim: "Para os amigos tudo, para os indiferentes nada, e para os inimigos a lei" (For my friends, everything; for strangers, nothing; for my enemies - the law!).

Since Brazil's society stresses direct relations based on personal liking as opposed to formal relations which are based on the law, the greatest fear of Brazilians is that of eventually becoming an isolated citizen. The isolated citizen is an inferior who is reduced to the condition of being merely "under" the law.

Accordingly, people without the necessary ability to develop such relationship ties have "only" the law on which to depend, whereas a citizen with "good" friends can also obtain any "special" treatment from the state and other institutions of prestige.

A phrase that is typically applied by people who expect such "special treatment" is "Você sabe com quem está falando?" ("Do you know whom you are talking to?"). It is often used by those who wish to somehow disobey formal rules, and as such it can be applied to a vast range of situations. A common application is when a police officer is "daring" to apply a fine for parking infringement. In such a case it is the officer himself who risks being punished if he tries to enforce the law.

It is not so much that the individual declaring personal exemption from the law necessarily views it as being wrong or unfair; it is just that he or she believes the law does not apply to a person like him or her. To obey it would be beneath him or her. The premise is that he or she possesses the privilege of being "more equal" than others, and so exercises the prerogative to ignore the law with impunity and utter arrogance. This sort of behaviour, argues history professor José Murilo de Carvalho, might be provoked by the mixed nature of the Brazilian citizen which he describes in the following terms:

"Master and slave live together inside him. When occupying positions of power he exhibits the arrogance of a master, when outside power he oscillates between servility and rebelliousness. A true citizen conscious of his (legal) rights and mindful of the rights of others did not develop... This cultural trait may help to explain the persistence of (social) inequality whose major victims are the descendents of the former slaves.

In reality, the fact that many people in Brazil often consider themselves above the law might be a legacy of the institution of slavery infecting contemporary Brazilian society. The hypothesis posits that slavery might have contributed to a low value being placed on compliance with law. While slavery was abolished a long time ago, in May 1888, a master-slave mentality might still permeate Brazil's social relations. According to Joseph A. Page,

"There are... societal ills that can be traced at least in part to slavery. For example, the slave owner could do as he pleased with his slaves without having to answer to anyone for the consequences of his actions. The master-slave relationship replicated the medieval relationship between Portuguese king and his subjects, and it came to define the link between the powerful and the powerless in Brazil... Indeed, a sense of being above the law became a prerogative of the nation's haves. The notion of impunity - the avoidance of personal responsibility - became deeply ingrained in Brazilianness and has proved a barrier to development."

To understand the reasons for problems blocking the rule of law from taking hold in Brazilian society, we need to investigate these patterns of social behaviour that inhibit the normal respect for legal norms and principles.

The abysmal difference in Brazil between legal provisions and reality, bears a good testimony to the fact that "good laws" might be important, but what really matters is individual, straightforward conduct, which in turn is the natural result of a culture of legality entailing the willingness by all citizens, including judges and politicians, to honestly respect legal obligations.

Indeed, Brazil does not have the rule of law because Brazilians have not yet developed this kind of culture.

Augusto Zimmermann, LLB, LLM, PhD is a Law Lecturer at Murdoch University, Western Australia. This article is based on a paper presented at annual conference of the Australian Society of Legal Philosophy, June 13-15 2008.

[JMBroad]

Raimundo - when were you last here in Brazil?

What I said earlier is Brazil is a relationship country, the same as Portugal. If anyone comes to Brazil and does the typical "gringo" thing, they may well get scammed, maybe worse and in my opinion it serves them right and good for the Brazilian that does it. Serves them right.

Now to elaborate so that the above doesn't offend too many people:

This is what I understand by "typical gringo thing".

American standing in line in front of me in Sintra (Portugal) at the museum screaming at the lady behind the counter "what do you mean you don't accept dollars?? this is real money lady!!"

Englishman at Lisbon airport before the Euro came out "Hi, I'd like to get some Pesetas to spend while here - where can I get some"

Portuguese in Brazil: Ordering Brazilians around like slaves - yelling and screaming at them over a minor detail (can't remember exactly what it was) - the language he was using wouldn't even be appropriate to address a dog.

Spanish in Brazil refusing to even try and speak Portuguese because "they can understand Spanish and if they can't they should learn". Refusing to accept that the notary is closed because there is a general strike and claiming that "they should open up anyway, or else"

People who refuse to acknowledge the countries habits, customs, who refuse to even try and learn the language (even if it's only please and thank you, try...) and those that think they are better than the local population because they live in Europe or the US are the ones that will get scammed by the locals 9/10. Basically if they see you as being an easy target then you are much more likely to get scammed.

As for avoiding it, just do the same you would do at home. You wouldn't give someone your hard earned cash without being sure that everything is legal and above board at home, so don't do it abroad. Either check it yourself (if you know what to look for and can speak the language) or hire someone to do it for you who does know what to look for and can speak the language. If you are hiring someone to do it for you, use someone you can check up on, either way never enter into it blindly.

[PAUL-brasil]

Good post, totally agree with you Mr Broad!

From my many trips to Brazil (and very soon to be a resident!) my experiences has been mostly fantastic, mainly due to the Brazilian people, yes of cause there is a different culture, but they are human just like the rest of us and there is both kind and cruel people in Brazil just like anywhere else you may go in the world. I have bought real estate, have come across a few minor problems, like anywhere, but overall I am so glad that I did it.

Originally Posted by robh

Raimundo, first of all I agree with FCZ's comments I have seen what you write.

ROBH, your opinions are an opinion, and I respect your opinion.

Secondly this is what you wrote: "We entrusted in Brasilians; big mistake! Brazilians are very slick people, imaginitive, quick on their feet, savvy, shrewd with great instincts -- they're always thinking of new ways to take from you. " Tell me how any Brazilian is not going to insulted by that.

I stated my opinion about Brazilians, most, certainly not all fall under this category.

Somehow I doubt your posts affect my personal income at all, but next time you want to tell people to be careful try and do it without insulting a whole country.....

Again sir, I am stating my opinion about what I think. It was not meant to offend. In fact being called "shrewd", "savvy" and "great instincts" are a compliment in my book.

ROBH- The bottom line is my reputation speaks for itself and whether you like it or not people take my opinions seriously. We had no recourse in Brazil, but here (Totallyproperty.com), I can at least warn people about the pitfalls of doing business in Brazil--so this in a way, is a little "pay back" if you will. I can raise awareness about the lack of law, morals and scruples in Brazil, and the lack of good character when your back is against the wall.

ROBH- I’ll say it again: Most, not all, but most Brazilians will take from you if given the opportunity.

I've not only traveled to/from and within Brazil since 1999, but lived in other Latin countries as well; Colombia and Costa Rica (bought/sold two properties in CR) And I've (my group) have conducted real estate business in Brazil (Rio/Natal - check archives). I own a popular website and Forum about Latin America and sell three books on Latin women (co-wrote one and updated/edited two others).

Now ROBH - what is your experience in central and south America including Brazil?

Originally Posted by JMBroad

Raimundo - when were you last here in Brazil?

7 days ago.... stayed about 2 months in Rio de Janeiro.

Anyone coming to Brazil and does the typical "gringo" thing, in my opinion serves them right, and good for the Brazilian that does it. Serves them right.

Unbelievable comment from a non-Brazilian working as a first world person in an arguably 3rd world area (northeast Brazil). Mr. Broad, I am not the typical American and don't pigeon hole my countrymen just because a few are complete assholes. The same can be said for Europeans, Asians, Saudis, Africans, Australians, etc.

Ralph- interesting article!

[robh]

Ray,

If you want to go and call "most people" in a country a thief go ahead.

I have plenty of experience in Brazil, my experience differs a lot to yours, and I have been involved in about a hundred real estate transactions there, I have done a lot of business in lots of other countries around the world to compare it with as well.

Don't worry I am not saying Brazil is squeaky clean and easy at all, but if you want bad go and do business somewhere like Nigeria or Angola.

Out of interest how many copies does your book "The Secrets To Romancing The Latin and Brazilian Woman" sell?

Regards,
Rob.

Originally Posted by Raimundo

ROBH, your opinions are an opinion, and I respect your opinion.



I stated my opinion about Brazilians, most, certainly not all fall under this category.



Again sir, I am stating my opinion about what I think. It was not meant to offend. In fact being called "shrewd", "savvy" and "great instincts" are a compliment in my book.

ROBH- The bottom line is my reputation speaks for itself and whether you like it or not people take my opinions seriously. We had no recourse in Brazil, but here (Totallyproperty.com), I can at least warn people about the pitfalls of doing business in Brazil--so this in a way, is a little "pay back" if you will. I can raise awareness about the lack of law, morals and scruples in Brazil, and the lack of good character when your back is against the wall.

ROBH- I’ll say it again: Most, not all, but most Brazilians will take from you if given the opportunity.

I've not only traveled to/from and within Brazil since 1999, but lived in other Latin countries as well; Colombia and Costa Rica (bought/sold two properties in CR) And I've (my group) have conducted real estate business in Brazil (Rio/Natal - check archives). I own a popular website and Forum about Latin America and sell three books on Latin women (co-wrote one and updated/edited two others).

Now ROBH - what is your experience in central and south America including Brazil?

[JUSTKICKIT]

I bought a bungalow in jacuma beach resort back in May and the construction was supposed to start in July but we are in October and I haven't heard anything yet. I know Sol Melia had delayed it for a couple months. Has anyone been to the site recently to see what is going on or can anyone tell me when the construction is supposed to start ?

[Dotty]

Somebody had written on here that it had started (well at least a road)but other than not not sure.There are plenty still for sale so that could be the delay.Why not get intouch with the person who sold it to you or the construction company.

Good luck

Originally Posted by JUSTKICKIT

I bought a bungalow in jacuma beach resort back in May and the construction was supposed to start in July but we are in October and I haven't heard anything yet. I know Sol Melia had delayed it for a couple months. Has anyone been to the site recently to see what is going on or can anyone tell me when the construction is supposed to start ?