Which country should I buy in?

[docmood]

Originally Posted by AnotherPropertyGuy

My gut feeling is that Asia is the best place for risk/reward at present.

Which country do you think I should invest in and why?

You are right on the money there if you can deal with a little bit of risk. It's often said that "...when theres blood on the streets, buy property...". Don't know who said it but he was dead right.

Pakistan JUST discovered democracy and is a partner in the USA's war on terror. The capital city in Islamabad is a safe and secure area within the turmoil of this country and a decent property here can cost upwards of 1 million GBP !! Islamabad is TINY right now but there are major plans afoot from some major world developers including EMAAR, AL GHURAIR GIGA, and a bunch of others I can't remember who have invested HEAVILY in Pakistan...and I'm talking BILLIONS of dollars in real estate. The government has just launched a programme for building 1 million housing units. Islamabad is due to expand VERY quickly and there is already a housing shortage there.

To buy property there, you either need a local partner, permission from the government, a Pakistani with a dual nationality friend that you can trust and have an agreement with him to hold hte property on your behalf, executed in the UK or USA or wherever.

If you are looking to invest a MILLION or more then the best thing is to go and find a local partner in Islamabad and setup a company with them to buy and hold property.

Stick to the anything within the federal limits of the capital Islamabad that falls under the Capital Development Authority ( CDA ) and you will see 200 -500% increases within 2 years.

I bought land in early 2006 in partnership with a local company who is doing a large housing project there and have already seen my capital covered and the market launch of the housing scheme is in December which is when we are expecting a great response due to the housing shortage and lack of quality builders.

[docmood]

Originally Posted by Ros818

Dubai is the smartest place to invest right now,

YEAH RIGHT !
I've been buying and selling property in Dubai since 2002 when they initially launched a number fo semi gov companies and projects including EMAAR's developments at the Greens, Dubai Marina, Springs and Meadows. I bought townhouses and apartments mainly due to my experience in this type of investment. Smaller and cheaper (although good quality) properties are always easier to buy ( less capital ) and easier to sell for the same reason plus it enabled me to spread my portfolio out into the various developments. I sold most of my properties in 20005 and 2006 at around 2 to 3 times the price paid plus i had been making on average 10-12% on rental return for a couple of years. Up until last year, I had 2 apartments remaining and I decided that that was the time to exit the market due.

It's taken me over a year to sell just one of them and I still have one remaining which it looks like I'll have to keep as there are literally THOUSANDS of desperate investors who are trying to dump their properties.

These are people who were lured in by the after-hype to keep the bubble from bursting 2-3 years ago and put down 5% or 10% deposits and then were convinced by the agents that they should pay just ONE MORE installment and are now in a situation where they cannot afford the property they bought adn are trying to dump it before they lose their deposits even if that means they take a hit.

Analysts are now admitting that Dubai will see a SLIGHT CORRECTION over the next couple of years....NOW THATS AN UNDERSTATEMENT !!

If you still have proeprty there, good luck trying to sell it...just take the first offer you get....if your are THINKING ABOUT BUYING - FOR GODS SAKE DON'T !!!!

[mickthepropertyguru]

well said Docmood, that something that i have been thinking for a while now. I'm so stick and tired of every agent promoting Dubai as the best place to invest when in truth its far from it.
The truth is, i cant think of anywhere in the world i'd would invest in right now!

[EuroGroup]

Originally Posted by mickthepropertyguru

When & where did "highest real estate price increase in Europe" occur ????????
And where is the "best analysts Bulgarian real estate market is the most underestimated in Europe." coming from ????????

I think there is thousands of buyers in Bulgaria that would beg to differ !!
Its very easy for house worth 3000 euro in the country to jump up a hundred percent. Its a different story for any property in the the over priced, over saturated area of the Black sea coast.
There is a world of difference between a cheap holiday home and an investment.
There is a reason why they are "good value" ..........Have a guess !
And the season is closer to 4 months than 6 months.
Be interesting to see what the banks are valuing the properties at !

I'd appreciate a reply !

Hi Mick,

Here I can paste first three links I found to answer your questions:

1. House price increase in Bulgaria highest for Europe, second world-wide:
House price increase in Bulgaria highest for Europe, second world-wide - Residential Article

2. Bulgarian property prices still rising:
Global Property Guide: Bulgaria - Bulgaria property prices still rising

3.House Prices Increase, Bulgaria Reaches 31%
Real Estate House Prices Increase, Bulgaria Reaches 31%


Finally, I wrote that the season lasts 5 months. Firstly check those links:

Ruse, BGR Weather - Forecasts, Radar Maps, Video, and News
Plovdiv, BGR Weather - Forecasts, Radar Maps, Video, and News
Wind & weather statistic / Wind & Wetter Statistik Burgas for Kitesurfing, Windsurfing, Surfing and Sailing

then consider AVERAGE temperatures:
MAY --->25 Celsius degrees
JUNE -> 29 Celsius degrees
JULY -> 31 Celsius degrees
AUGUST -> 30 Celsius degrees
SEPTEMBER -> 26 Celsius degrees
in April and October average temperature is 19. I wrote only about 5 months, but you know better without checking anything...


I don't have an information how many buyers are begging to differ. As I noticed, you are the statistic guru also, so maybe you can count the amount of people unsatisfied with purchasing a property in Bulgaria. I think that you also don't know those people, because in other case you would write me numbers and statistics, wouldn't you ??
The only think I am sure and I can write about it are satisfied clients. They are buying houses, villas, hotels and holiday apartments as well. In mountains and close to the sea (not more than 600 meters from the beach). Some of them rents their properties even all year, so 12-month time.

And, excuse me, but 3000 euro which you mentioned can be a one month rental payment not price of the house ! If you think so, it means that you completely don't know Bulgarian real estate market reality. For 30 000 EURO, not 3 000 EURO (!!!), you can buy a house about 30 kilometers from the sea, in a very small and not interesting village. If it is your idea to make a good investment, then congratulations ! After this deal you can really only beg to sell it, as you wrote a few days ago. But do not expect any profit for completely not interesting property 30 km from the coast.

[mickthepropertyguru]

Thanks for the response EuroGroup. I going to look over the links tonight and get back to you.
Im loking forward to it actually

[mickthepropertyguru]

Originally Posted by EuroGroup

Hi Mick,

Here I can paste first three links I found to answer your questions:

1. House price increase in Bulgaria highest for Europe, second world-wide:
House price increase in Bulgaria highest for Europe, second world-wide - Residential Article

2. Bulgarian property prices still rising:
Global Property Guide: Bulgaria - Bulgaria property prices still rising
3.House Prices Increase, Bulgaria Reaches 31%
Real Estate House Prices Increase, Bulgaria Reaches 31%


Finally, I wrote that the season lasts 5 months. Firstly check those links:

Ruse, BGR Weather - Forecasts, Radar Maps, Video, and News
Plovdiv, BGR Weather - Forecasts, Radar Maps, Video, and News
Wind & weather statistic / Wind & Wetter Statistik Burgas for Kitesurfing, Windsurfing, Surfing and Sailing

then consider AVERAGE temperatures:
MAY --->25 Celsius degrees
JUNE -> 29 Celsius degrees
JULY -> 31 Celsius degrees
AUGUST -> 30 Celsius degrees
SEPTEMBER -> 26 Celsius degrees
in April and October average temperature is 19. I wrote only about 5 months, but you know better without checking anything...


I don't have an information how many buyers are begging to differ. As I noticed, you are the statistic guru also, so maybe you can count the amount of people unsatisfied with purchasing a property in Bulgaria. I think that you also don't know those people, because in other case you would write me numbers and statistics, wouldn't you ??
The only think I am sure and I can write about it are satisfied clients. They are buying houses, villas, hotels and holiday apartments as well. In mountains and close to the sea (not more than 600 meters from the beach). Some of them rents their properties even all year, so 12-month time.

And, excuse me, but 3000 euro which you mentioned can be a one month rental payment not price of the house ! If you think so, it means that you completely don't know Bulgarian real estate market reality. For 30 000 EURO, not 3 000 EURO (!!!), you can buy a house about 30 kilometers from the sea, in a very small and not interesting village. If it is your idea to make a good investment, then congratulations ! After this deal you can really only beg to sell it, as you wrote a few days ago. But do not expect any profit for completely not interesting property 30 km from the coast.

First of all, anybody that has worked in the real estate business in Bulgaria knows the crisis that is happening along the Black Sea coast right now! People cant sell their investment and they cant get any decent rent. I know because i talked to many when i worked in the industry and afterwards. But we will have a poll and the investors can make up their own mind.

The first link you posted refers to property in 2007, a lot has changed since then, credit crunch, recession etc. The third link seems to be posted in 2005/ 2006.

The second link is the only up to date reference. It does say that Bulgaria is increasing in value, but i think we know this isnt in the Black sea coast or Bansko which are the places i was referring to.
But why is it only given a 2 star rating out of five ? And the rental yield is rated around 4.6%. I mean i can get that in a bank without any magaement fees and the rest that goes with renting!


I cant see the exit strategy anymore, the Russians seem to be the only savior for the thousands of Brits and Irish who were flogged overpriced properties with false promises. Why cant people sell their investment if this is the place everybody should be investing in ? Proof, go to any Bulgarian forum on renting and people are despairing at the lack of rent from their investment.
But lets not mix up investment property with holiday home properties. Sure you can get a good value holiday home as people are selling at 20% - 30% under the price they bought it for.


And most of the airlines seem to stop in September, Balkan holidays and Thomsonfly are among the few who actually operate in october. Most airlines operate for around a four month period like My Travel.

Doesn't the airport in Bourgas nearly close from November to April ? I mean it practically shuts down and anybody who wants to got o sunny beach has to fly to Varna !

The only saving grace for Bulgaria is Sofia. This is the only area and market worth investing in and in my opinion its a bit late as it is risky getting into a maturing market like Sofia a this stage.
But where are people getting in excess of 12% rental yields ?

My issue with you is that you promoting a country only the savvy investor will win at this stage. It not for the novice.


"The largest foreign investors in Bulgaria in 2007 are reported to be the UK, Austria, Greece, Belgium, Spain, Cyprus, and Luxembourg." Novinite.com

In times of recession, people offload any excess baggage like overseas property. Property in the UK, Ireland, Lithuania, Poland, Belgium, Spain, Cyprus, and Luxembourg, Estonia, are all coming down in price. Unemployment is rising. Most of the investor countries (GDP and property prices) that have invested in Bulgaria are falling in the region of 15% -30%.What do you think will happen , i'll tell you. They are going to offload their non rentable properties in Bulgaria to generate cash. And then the bubble will be well and truly burst

[rossantony]

near portugal, overlooking the river, i have a lovely 3 bed if you want at a knock down price!

[mache25]

I'm looking for serious investors to ROMANIA, large developing country, there are towns that will be developed, is guaranteed profit in the shortest time! Last year I bought land for a company in Israel with 8E/mp and now worth 80E/mp, so 110 Hectares purchased see profit! Waiting collaborators! The market has not dropped as some say!

[okisen]

in reply to bulgaria, yes it is true that in the tourist-only areas there is a over-supply and it will take time to work through those, though the very top-end properties are selling well.
The place to buy in bulgaria imo is in larger, growing cities and their subburbs,where the bulgarians themselves are buying and where the market is not only relying on tourists. prices in Varna, sofia, borgas, veliko tarnovo, ruse etc are rising 15-20%+ in 2008 which is very decent in this market. The average wealth of a bulgarian rose 28% last year, and mortgages are now becoming available and popular among the average bulgarians. GDP is growing 7%! this year. look for residential land or industrial land in the new suburbs imo and do your research. im still buying plots and there are good bargains to be had if u take your time.

other areas im looking into is northern Brazil and Belize but im still doing research.
kas

[odond]

I think the question is too global and will cause fraction on the site. I work for FrenchProperty Ireland and give you all the good reasons to buy in France but I presume it is the same for everyone. You should narrow your search down to whether or not you want a pure investments, short term or long term, if you want to use the buy etc etc and then you can make a clear cut choice on which country you should buy in.